@lockeproposal and anyone else who cares to chip in.
When did Europe forget that Islam was at war with it?
@lockeproposal and anyone else who cares to chip in.
When did Europe forget that Islam was at war with it?
i found a short article - http://www.wnd.com/2016/08/reverse-assimilation-the-muslim-takeover-of-europe/
Fifty years ago, there was already a noticeable influx of refugees from Muslim countries. Islam was a reality, but it had not evolved into this multi-faceted ideology punctuating the lives of a newer generation of Muslims. Islam of the 1950 and ’60s was harmless – harmless because it wasn’t political and hadn’t had a chance to get radicalized yet.
Back then, the willingness of most European countries to take in immigrants was somewhat shrouded with naiveté. These destitute and abused people needed protection regardless of their upbringing, countries of origin and/or religion. None of it mattered when it came to providing them with safe haven, and rightfully so – even if there was the ulterior motive of cheap labor. It was the right thing to do then, but is it still the right thing to do now? In theory, yes, but things are much more complicated today than they were 50 years ago.
It seems to have snowballed for decades
ahhh.. I'm thinking in the last 100-300 years. Before that, people knew what was going on locally because of talking with with their community directly. Since the printing press and reliance on word-of-mouth vs experience, it's a lot easier to make people realize (or forget) what's really going on around them.
edit: as far as specifics, I was educated in Merica, we didn't have much European history :p
Interesting question. Europe controlled much of the Muslim world from the early 1900s through the post-WW2 era. So at least the governments were aware of Islam. Of course, political Islam wasn't as radicalized as it is today. Probably hard to put an exact year on it, but probably in the 1990s when political correctness started to outweigh any legitimate discussion about facts.
I saw this yesterday and the average European would have been well aware of Barbary raids etc if they lived along the shoreline. Islam has been trying to take Europe for a long time.
For sure, it is a conflict that has been going on for centuries. I think the post-colonial era made Europe think that it was all ancient history and they had nothing to fear from their former subjects who just want to bask in their (fading) glory of European power and culture.
Define "Europe" and define "Islam". European countries have been at war with Islamic countries at various times throughout all history, and it wasn't until 1908 the last majority Christian nations, Bulgaria and Crete, got independent of the Ottoman empire. I'd call 1923, the year Atatürk became president of Turkey, a major breaking point when Turkey ceased to be a threat to islamize the Balkan.
On the reverse, European countries kept a strong grip on majority muslim North Africa into the middle of the 20th century, with Britain in Egypt, Italy in Libya and France in the rest of the Maghreb. I'd say that Algeria's independence in 1962 was the breaking point for that line of conflict.
So, discounting the Yugoslavian wars in the 1990s, you look back at roughly 50-100 years, dependent on if your country has been rather faced with the Turks or with the North African muslims.
I think defining 'war' would also be useful in this context. Whatever 'Islam' is supposed to be, it's far more seriously at war with itself than Europe.
Honestly, my knowledge of Islamic history is woefully inadequate to answer this question. Sorry I couldn't be of more help here :(
Well, if you take it back far enough, Europe was at war with Islamic countries for centuries. As a result of our interaction with the Muslim world, we actually gained quite a lot. Technology and medicine that had been forgotten during the dark ages became available to Europe again after our interaction with Islamic countries, because they had it and we didn't. This played a part in several very important inventions over the next few centuries, like the printing press, which ultimately began to remove power from the church because it was the first time people could read religious texts for themselves instead of hearing it from the church. We also established trade with Islamic countries after the wars had begun to die down, which helped to catapult us into the renaissance.
So after all of this time, the situation on our side has become skewed. In this period of history, we broke through and the kebab didn't. It isn't a question of religion in Europe anymore, it isn't even a question of nationalism anymore. But it is in the Islamic world. It isn't that people don't recognise that there is a certain level of hostility that exists in Islamic countries, it's just that we have progressed beyond the point where that hostility is valid in any way to us, it is alien. In my opinion, this will work itself out over time. The problems that Europe has at the moment is nothing even remotely close to the ones we had in the past, so it is better to just carry on with business as usual and let it all play out.
If you would have a look at this? You'll see that the Muslims tear apart and consume the classical world with a series of relentless battles. They didn't save that knowledge for us, they took it from us and then bits of it leaked back centuries later. Look at the waves of attacks hitting what is now Italy for example, that would have disrupted any attempts of the remnants of Rome that may have risen again. What if without the Islamic attacks a Nuovo Roma may have happened within a couple of centuries?
Sure they did, but that's what happened everywhere back then. It is also important to note the makeup of European armies. During those times, national armies were not really a thing, and big armies weren't a thing either. European armies were small and split up between various different noblemen and such. That is the reason we got completely fucked by the Mongols out of nowhere, because nobody had large armies and it took a lot for them to organise and agree to fight together. Muslim armies were far better at organisation, at first because they were nomadic forces, and later because their armies were more centralised than European ones.
Rome's influence waned entirely because of Rome. In fact, if Rome governed itself better, the church would not have had anywhere near the amount of influence they ended up having. When the Romans vanished, the church became the government. Whilst the church did use a religious angle to whip up armies from different countries, I would argue that the expansion from Muslim countries during that time had a lot more to do with expansion for the empire's sake, rather than being religiously motivated. The church had to use a religious excuse to get the armies together because of the makeup of the forces in Europe, Muslim leaders did not because the armies were already there.
when the people who control the media told them they weren't