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If you insist they give up their culture immediately you will be seen as trying to take away their culture. Just like how gun rights advocates perceive attacks on gun culture.

Solidarity is a normal reaction to real or perceived hostility. In history the social pressure to assimilate resulted in immigrant collectivism in order to support each other; Chinatowns, little Italy and a myriad other ethnic enclaves formed partly because of this pressure.

If you insist they give up their culture immediately you will be seen as trying to take away their culture. Just like how gun rights advocates perceive attacks on gun culture. Solidarity is a normal reaction to real or perceived hostility. In history the social pressure to assimilate resulted in immigrant collectivism in order to support each other; Chinatowns, little Italy and a myriad other [ethnic enclaves](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethnic_enclave) formed partly because of this pressure.

26 comments

[–] [Deleted] 2 points (+2|-0)

The collectivism is what helps them keep their culture while they assimilate. This new wave of "accept the Muslims" is totally different because of the weak, everyone get a participation award, mentality. Muslims are not assimilating at all, yet want everyone else to live the way they do! Believe the same things they do. I see it day in and out. When you've worked in a Muslim dense area for a few years please come back and tell us what you've seen.

[–] phoxy [OP] 1 points (+2|-1)

Muslims are not assimilating at all, yet want everyone else to live the way they do! Believe the same things they do.

First, I'm glad you framed the fear in terms of religion instead of ethnicity. It's more honest than pretending these immigrants are different than all others in history.

Second, I get more pressure from Christians, Jehovah's Witnesses, consumerists, stoners, drunks, and Greenpeace to "live the way they do" and "believe the same things they do." There are proselytizers in every group.

And you are being hypocritical. You are pressuring Muslims to "live the way you do" even while you complain that they do it to you.

[–] [Deleted] 2 points (+2|-0)

The reason I'm not being hypocritical is that I'm not of the belief that Muslims should totally see and believe the way Americans do. What I'm saying is that they don't mesh at all with any culture at all.

Immigrants are expected to somewhat assimilate and that's how it has always worked.

That is also why o don't call them immigrants but soldiers looking to occupy other nations.

Again, come back when you've lived with them and actually see with your own eyes how they live. I'm sure it is easy for you to pass your self righteous judgements from on top of you high horse.

[–] phoxy [OP] 0 points (+1|-1)

You are assuming I live in an area without Muslim immigrants.

What I'm saying is that they don't mesh at all with any culture at all.

My experience has been the opposite. Generalizations and stereotypes are harmful.

I have seen immigrant Muslim comedians, cashiers, restaurantiers and entrepreneurs. I have seen Muslim women in western dress and makeup. I have seen immigrant Muslim children with all the toys and brands that other kids have.

Our anecdotes support my point: if the host culture is hostile people cling more tightly to their ways, the familiar that provides security and comfort.

The collectivism is what helps them keep their culture while they assimilate.

I'm not of the belief that Muslims should totally see and believe the way Americans do.

Immigrants are expected to somewhat assimilate and that's how it has always worked.

Yes that is my original point: if you accept and help immigrants they assimilate faster. Pressuring them to abandon their familiar culture for an alien one hinders assimilation (in response they seek support from more friendly people: other immigrants).