So Biden's gonna poop out a capital gains tax increase for people earning $1 million or more.

[–] CDanger 3 points (+3|-0)

it's now enough to ensure that you will NEVER retire from a lump sum amount of $1 million ($1 million goes very fast). You will need $2 million for a middle age adult to retire.

That has far more to do with the rampant asset price inflation in the stock market and housing market due to insane government deficit spending and low interest rates.

$5 million for the same adult to retire comfortably. About $7 million for someone in their 20s to do the same.

The numbers are way off here. With $2 million, you could safely and comfortably withdraw 4% ($80k) per year forever while paying zero federal taxes and even grow your savings. That's more than enough so long as you don't live in a big city.

As it is now, the tax code punishes earned income and gives special treatment to investment income like this; if you earn a $100k salary per year you pay federal taxes, while if that instead is gains from the stock market, you pay $0. So while I think this change won't really do much to help the country, it isn't going to impact the average person really since the average person will never generate anything approaching $1 million in a year. This change doesn't hurt middle class people, unless you extend middle class to include those at tech startups who get millions in a big windfall when their company sells out/goes public. I don't feel sorry for them at all since they overwhelming voted for Biden.

I would like to see inheritances taxed far more. Right now something like the first $20 million are exempt, and even after that they aren't taxed aggressively. Nobody needs to inherit anything more than $10 million or something like that. It just creates bad incentives in society that let skill-less, lazy, and irresponsible fucks (e.g. Hunter Biden) get into Ivy League schools when they otherwise would stand no change. It creates zombie generations of heirs who either have no ability yet magically end up running companies or who go on coked-out benders all the time. It crowds out those working and with talent. It degrades the meritocracy. It means somebody with talent who wants to work hard and start a business no has to pay a higher tax rate to essentially subsidize some Rockefeller heir. It damages society, and it's also bad for the families themselves even.

> it's now enough to ensure that you will NEVER retire from a lump sum amount of $1 million ($1 million goes very fast). You will need $2 million for a middle age adult to retire. That has far more to do with the rampant asset price inflation in the stock market and housing market due to insane government deficit spending and low interest rates. > $5 million for the same adult to retire comfortably. About $7 million for someone in their 20s to do the same. The numbers are way off here. With $2 million, you could safely and comfortably withdraw 4% ($80k) per year forever while paying zero federal taxes and even grow your savings. That's more than enough so long as you don't live in a big city. As it is now, the tax code punishes earned income and gives special treatment to investment income like this; if you earn a $100k salary per year you pay federal taxes, while if that instead is gains from the stock market, you pay $0. So while I think this change won't really do much to help the country, it isn't going to impact the average person really since the average person will never generate anything approaching $1 million in a year. This change doesn't hurt middle class people, unless you extend middle class to include those at tech startups who get millions in a big windfall when their company sells out/goes public. I don't feel sorry for them at all since they overwhelming voted for Biden. I would like to see inheritances taxed far more. Right now something like the first $20 million are exempt, and even after that they aren't taxed aggressively. Nobody needs to inherit anything more than $10 million or something like that. It just creates bad incentives in society that let skill-less, lazy, and irresponsible fucks (e.g. Hunter Biden) get into Ivy League schools when they otherwise would stand no change. It creates zombie generations of heirs who either have no ability yet magically end up running companies or who go on coked-out benders all the time. It crowds out those working and with talent. It degrades the meritocracy. It means somebody with talent who wants to work hard and start a business no has to pay a higher tax rate to essentially subsidize some Rockefeller heir. It damages society, and it's also bad for the families themselves even.

[–] ScorpioGlitch [OP] 0 points (+0|-0)

Edited

That has far more to do with the rampant asset price inflation in the stock market and housing market due to insane government deficit spending and low interest rates.

That's not how any of that works. Literally a 40% tax rate. What you said has nothing to do with anything.

The numbers are way off here.

I need to show you the math, then and we're going to do it with an average middle class family.

House mortgage: $200,000

Student loans: maybe $100,000. Per adult.

Save for the child's college education: $100,000.

We haven't even touched thrifted furniture that's falling apart, that 10 year old bed with a sag in the middle. A car to replace the junker you're still paying on.

Where we at? Let's see, you get $1 million, taxed at 40% leaves $600,000. That leaves $200,000. No one is retiring on $200,00. Ever.

Two million leaves you enough to retire on.

if you earn a $100k salary per year you pay federal taxes,

You pay 30ish% after the state takes its pound of flesh. Unless you're in New York where they want to tax you at 50%. At least.

There's nothing left. You get two paychecks in most states of $2500 per month.

while if that instead is gains from the stock market, you pay $0

lulwut? No, you pay taxes on any income. You have tax forms you have to file. You get taxed on it like any income. Try doing some actual investing.

since the average person will never generate anything approaching $1 million in a year

Nah, just a one time inheritance or lottery win. At that point, you are still left with pretty much nothing. Like I said, you can't retire.

Right now something like the first $20 million are exempt, and even after that they aren't taxed aggressively.

35% is pretty aggressive. Not to mention any state tax on top of that. And I believe it's $5 million though I might be wrong. Even still, you're still hammered by a capital gains tax just like what Biden is increasing.

Nobody needs to inherit anything more than $10 million or something like that

It's theirs. They can have and do whatever they want. Just because you'll never have it doesn't mean no one else should. Stop with this attitude of "If I can't have it, no one can." It's pure evil.

You really should have put that first so I knew from the start not to take you serious.

>That has far more to do with the rampant asset price inflation in the stock market and housing market due to insane government deficit spending and low interest rates. That's not how any of that works. Literally a 40% tax rate. What you said has nothing to do with anything. >The numbers are way off here. I need to show you the math, then and we're going to do it with an average middle class family. House mortgage: $200,000 Student loans: maybe $100,000. Per adult. Save for the child's college education: $100,000. We haven't even touched thrifted furniture that's falling apart, that 10 year old bed with a sag in the middle. A car to replace the junker you're still paying on. Where we at? Let's see, you get $1 million, taxed at 40% leaves $600,000. That leaves $200,000. No one is retiring on $200,00. Ever. Two million leaves you enough to retire on. >if you earn a $100k salary per year you pay federal taxes, You pay 30ish% after the state takes its pound of flesh. Unless you're in New York where they want to tax you at 50%. [At least](https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2021-04-07/richest-new-york-residents-face-top-tax-rate-of-over-50-in-cuomo-s-budget-plan). There's nothing left. You get two paychecks in most states of $2500 per month. >while if that instead is gains from the stock market, you pay $0 lulwut? No, you pay taxes on any income. You have tax forms you have to file. You get taxed on it like any income. Try doing some actual investing. >since the average person will never generate anything approaching $1 million in a year Nah, just a one time inheritance or lottery win. At that point, you are still left with pretty much *nothing*. Like I said, you can't retire. >Right now something like the first $20 million are exempt, and even after that they aren't taxed aggressively. 35% is pretty aggressive. Not to mention any state tax on top of that. And I believe it's $5 million though I might be wrong. Even still, you're still hammered by a capital gains tax just like what Biden is increasing. >Nobody needs to inherit anything more than $10 million or something like that It's theirs. They can have and do whatever they want. Just because you'll never have it doesn't mean no one else should. Stop with this attitude of "If I can't have it, no one can." It's pure evil. You really should have put that first so I knew from the start not to take you serious.

[–] CDanger 3 points (+3|-0)

lulwut? No, you pay taxes on any income. You have tax forms you have to file. You get taxed on it like any income. Try doing some actual investing.

Completely false. This might in fact be one of the "loopholes" you're decrying that the "rich use".

https://www.thestreet.com/personal-finance/capital-gains-tax-14717438

If you're married filing jointly, you get $78k long-term capital gains + standard deduction $25k, so a little more than $100k per year tax free. If you're not getting that now, you should talk to your accountant or just fill out the standard 1040 and schedule D correctly.

As for the rest of the numbers, you seem to be conflating marginal vs effective tax rate in your calculations. If somebody builds a nest egg of $2 million, they can easily retire and have a higher standard of living than the average American today (and pay less taxes than that working family too). Now receiving $2million in a year is a different story and closer to what you're saying because they will get taxed on the whole amount there. Hence one of the principles of investing is to defer income and taxes. I don't have sympathy for people receiving these huge windfalls though. How out of touch is it to whine about receiving $2 million in a year? Poor you.

I don't care about lottery winners since there are, for practical purposes, zeros of them and their "plight" has zero bearing on how we should organize society; we should create incentives for people to work and grow wealth responsibly, not make hopeless and wild gambles.

It's theirs. They can have and do whatever they want. Just because you'll never have it doesn't mean no one else should. Stop with this attitude of "If I can't have it, no one can." It's pure evil.

That's quite an assumption about my attitude. Trust fund kids have no natural right to that money. We as society have made laws that allow them to receive it, but that doesn't make it inherently just or a good idea. It would be much wiser to make laws to incentivize people to work, create value, and improve things. Feudalism doesn't do that.

> lulwut? No, you pay taxes on any income. You have tax forms you have to file. You get taxed on it like any income. Try doing some actual investing. Completely false. This might in fact be one of the "loopholes" you're decrying that the "rich use". https://www.thestreet.com/personal-finance/capital-gains-tax-14717438 If you're married filing jointly, you get $78k long-term capital gains + standard deduction $25k, so a little more than $100k per year tax free. If you're not getting that now, you should talk to your accountant or just fill out the standard 1040 and schedule D correctly. As for the rest of the numbers, you seem to be conflating marginal vs effective tax rate in your calculations. If somebody _builds_ a nest egg of $2 million, they can easily retire and have a higher standard of living than the average American today (and pay less taxes than that working family too). Now _receiving_ $2million in a year is a different story and closer to what you're saying because they will get taxed on the whole amount there. Hence one of the principles of investing is to defer income and taxes. I don't have sympathy for people receiving these huge windfalls though. How out of touch is it to whine about receiving $2 million in a year? Poor you. I don't care about lottery winners since there are, for practical purposes, zeros of them and their "plight" has zero bearing on how we should organize society; we should create incentives for people to work and grow wealth responsibly, not make hopeless and wild gambles. > It's theirs. They can have and do whatever they want. Just because you'll never have it doesn't mean no one else should. Stop with this attitude of "If I can't have it, no one can." It's pure evil. That's quite an assumption about my attitude. Trust fund kids have no natural right to that money. We as society have made laws that allow them to receive it, but that doesn't make it inherently just or a good idea. It would be much wiser to make laws to incentivize people to work, create value, and improve things. Feudalism doesn't do that.

[–] ScorpioGlitch [OP] 0 points (+0|-0)

Not even gonna address anything else because there's no point once you said this:

That's quite an assumption about my attitude. Trust fund kids have no natural right to that money

Not your money, not your right. Their money, their right. Complain about your own life, not someone else's. Until you can deal with the envy you can't control, there's no point in discussing any of this with you.

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So Biden's gonna poop out a capital gains tax increase for people earning $1 million or more.

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/s/Whatever